Buying a Used Bike- Current Owner is not Registered in Greenbook

Discussion in 'General Discussion / News / Information' started by Billy Baht, Oct 8, 2013.

  1. Billy Baht

    Billy Baht Ol'Timer

    Well here goes: I saw a used 2008 carb model CBR150r for sale. Asking price is 28,000 with 21,000 kms on the odometer. The bike is registered in Bangkok.

    The current Thai owner, living in Pattaya, never transfered the bike into his name. He has the Greenbook, Transfer and POA forms (or so he says) He agreed to bring the bike, with all documents, to me tomorrow to look at. The photos look good (of course they would) and he said the bike was never wrecked, but engine "has some noise."

    I suppose the safest transaction would be to insist that we make the trade at Chonburi DLT (Pattaya will not transfer out of province bikes)

    A 2008 CBR150r for 28,000 baht sounds like a bargain, maybe too much so? Stolen? Engine problems?

    If I decide to buy it, probably best to insist that the current "Owner" go to the DLT with me; no transfer of the bike to in to my name, then no money :)

    Let me have your honest opinions and don't try to spare my feeling :)

    Thanks guys.
     
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  3. finnomick

    finnomick Ol'Timer

    Your thoughts about insisting the seller goes with you are a must because the bike will first have to be transferred into HIS name, and then yours. If he doesn't have all the requisite forms from whom he purchased the bike, then it cannot be transferred into your name = end of story. Whatever you do, do not buy the bike thinking you can take whatever paperwork he has or says he has and then go to the registration office. You could end up with some paperwork and a bike that you can NEVER sell or even have registered in your name.
     
  4. Billy Baht

    Billy Baht Ol'Timer

    I hear you Finn. Technically I would be buying the bike from the guy listed in the Greenbook.

    He might just be a guy that likes to dabble in motorcycle trading and wants to avoid the hassle and time involved in transfering bikes into his name. I wonder if being a bit coy, as in he is a friend, helping me with the language, might work. If DLT will put the bike in my name, then he gets the money; if not, then no deal.

    Any way I'm not in a hurry. I had a CBR150r before and it was nimble in traffic and decent on the highway, so I was thinking cheap transportation. I sorta like the second hand bike market, but I know I'm a relative newbie and must proceed with due caution.

    Thanks for your advice!

    BB
     
  5. TonyBKK

    TonyBKK Ol'Timer

    The original power of attorney form is only valid for 30 days. If you can't track down the legal owner I reckon you will be wasting your time trying to get this bike transferred into your name, but if you have the time to burn you could give it a try. Good luck!!
     
  6. johngooding

    johngooding Ol'Timer

    It is not unusual for people, especially the Thai's, not to bother with the transfer to put small bikes in their name. It may be that the Power of Attorney form was completed with the sellers details and signed, but not completed for buyers details and not dated, in which case if there is a copy of a valid ID card and details all correlate with the entry in the reg book, then it should be OK to fill in the rest and use it. It definitely does not have to go through the middle man first, if the bike can be transferred then it is just as easy to do to you direct. So if the Thai guy with the bike is willing to come to the DLT with you, then go for it, no payment to him until the transfer is done. If it goes wrong, he is the one with the problem, you only lose time. If he is not willing to accompany you then find a more straightforward deal, I am sure there will be others available.
     
  7. finnomick

    finnomick Ol'Timer

    John's comments, whilst valid just go to endorse what most of us here know, namely that no matter which government department you go to be it Immigration or the Land transport Office etc., the rules and interpretation thereof vary from one district to another. In my case, I had traveled down to Chantaburi from Pattaya to buy a bike. Great bike and the money was burning a hole in my pocket. We arrived at the Land transport Office with the seller. Duly completed the engine and frame number check and that is as far as we got. When we went inside to do the registration book transfer, the official said the seller was NOT the registered owner -- problem. After a lot of discussion and translation by my super misses, the seller said he had been trying to find the previous owner and subsequently found the bike had changed hands about 7 times before he bought it. At this stage we walked out. This taught me a lesson and that was to get the misses to do all the checks and verify all the paperwork. She is actually ( now ) one of the few Thais I know that DOES know what she is talking about when it comes to paperwork for vehicular transfer. Maybe she should set up an agency ? No please, only joking.......

    So the rule should be, if you smell a rat or are in any way suspicious, walk away. As John says, there are plenty more bikes available and some of these will be straight forward to transfer.
     
  8. johngooding

    johngooding Ol'Timer

    Just a final comment for me on this. I must have been lucky because when I have understood the requirements of a vehicle transfer, or a visa extension, or getting a yellow tabien bahn, etc and I have gone to the relevant office with the correct paperwork etc, I have never met this different interpretation of the rules. Of course if one does not really understand exactly what is required or if one does not have it then some offices will be more open to helping than others will. In Finnomicks case it seems obvious that if one tries to effect a transfer from someone who is not the legally registered owner of the bike, and if one does not have the Power of Attorney form, then the transfer will be refused. The whole point of getting a valid POA form from the registered owner is that the transfer can be made in his absence and so the office does not even ask who the other guy who is selling you the bike is. He should not get involved in the DLT office. The actual registered owner has signed away his need to be present, to allow a new buyer to do the transfer alone. The guy who bought it and now wants to sell to you did not bother to transfer to his name, so he is not the legal registered owner. In Billy's case he needs to check that the POA form has the correct owners details as in the bike book and that the copy ID is the same number and name as the owner. He then puts his details on the POA form as the buyer, signs and dates and goes along to the office with the bike and the book and his paperwork. The guy selling to him can stay in the background, if the transfer is successful, he pays the guy, all is well. If problems take away the bike and all the paperwork and give it back to the guy, time to find another bike.
     
  9. KZ25

    KZ25 Ol'Timer

    I've bought a bike from a Thai guy who has a shop with lots of new model Waves, Nouvos and some CBR250s. All bikes are still in the original owners name and he seems to have the power of attorney. This looked legit enough to me and I always insist that the seller comes with me to the Transportation Deptmt. No problems there and the guy is still in business.

    But when it comes to private sales I bail as soon as the seller is not not the owner. It smells like a "can of worms" and I don't need the aggravation.

    In a couple of months that CBR will be six years old; you don't know how many km it really has done - 28K is not a bargain! Plus the owner admits that "the engine has some noise".

    I'd pass on this one - there are better deals out there!
     
  10. Billy Baht

    Billy Baht Ol'Timer

    Good point about 30 days expiration date on the Power of Atty form
     
  11. Billy Baht

    Billy Baht Ol'Timer

    Thanks for the input guys; I'm giving this bike a pass.

    I've had my fill of Pattaya and I'm heading north :) Hope to meet up with a few riders in Chiang Mai and put a face to a name.

    Chok dee krab!
     
  12. johngooding

    johngooding Ol'Timer

    Certainly a good point, which is why the power of attorney form should be undated, you can then enter a valid date. Some people may be unhappy to leave undated, but as long as thy complete the parts of the form that detail the POA is for transfer of that particular motorcycle, then it is not like a blank check.
    Looking forward to seeing you in CM. Do let us know when you are coming
     
  13. Billy Baht

    Billy Baht Ol'Timer

    You nailed it buddy; the lady in posession of the bike told me that the engine repair would cost 5,000- but she "could do" some discount...

    I may even buy a used wave and beat around on that -don't flame me guys :) I did two trips to Chiang Mai on a Wave, once each from BKK and Pattaya.

    If a good deal comes up on a used Honda 250, 150 or Ninja 250, I may have a big bike again. Until then I will bide my time like a fish, floundering on the banks of life :)
     

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