Oils Aint Oils....

Discussion in 'Technical' started by brian_bkk, Jul 31, 2016.

  1. brian_bkk

    brian_bkk Ol'Timer

    Two Stroke Oils

    There are much older threads regarding this topic.
    So as not to confuse things and with advances in technology / oils / bikes and brands..
    Start a fresh thread for this discussion..

    Firstly.. Not looking to be a cheap skate.. just value for money.
    Paying 1100 baht for Moto Rex Two stroke is just not warranted.. ( Dirt Worx Pattaya still selling at 1000 baht a litre RRP 1,100 )
    Then you have Motul at 600 baht a litre.

    I know bugger all about mechanics and rely on friends for input and not afraid to ask questions.

    When I asked at Dirt Worx.. Why Moto Rex over Motul or other decent brand..
    The answer was the life span of the piston.. BUT.. If you are saving 500 baht a litre on Two stroke oil and a piston / ring set only costs 7000 baht.
    You are better off using the Motul or other cheaper brand..

    Dirtworx looking in to getting Repsol or other proven reliable brand at a cheaper price..
    Rather than the insane Moto Rex prices.

    Just out of interest.. Has any one used the local two stroke oils?
    Example below - Shell? I bought this as only 90 baht and more out of interest to read / understand the label..
    No intention to use it at this stage..

    Any one else have factual based knowledge on two stroke oils.
    ( not just brand loyalty please, or statements like you can't trust it as made in Thailand )
    Local or overseas brands at a decent price..

    I have no issue paying 1100 or 600 if that is what it takes..
    More intrigued... How much of this is marketing.
    Then of course you will have rubbish products that should be avoided..

    Brian DSC_2575-480x853.JPG DSC_2576-480x853.JPG
    hs0zfe likes this.
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  3. brian_bkk

    brian_bkk Ol'Timer

  4. brian_bkk

    brian_bkk Ol'Timer

  5. mudboots

    mudboots Ol'Timer

    Yes I was using the above Shell oil as well as whatever 2 stroke oil I could find up Mae Sai way the price did not bother me all that much.
    If I could have found full synthetic 2 stroke oil I would have been using it next to no smoke as much better for ring ware.
    As for gearbox oil for your 2 stroke just about any motor oil will do I even used auto transmission fluid but in saying that avoid motor oils that have half or more synthetics in it as it will be to slippery on your Clutch. I for one used to change my gear box oil after 10 to 15 hours riding time.
  6. brian_bkk

    brian_bkk Ol'Timer

  7. Moto-Rex

    Moto-Rex Ol'Timer

    Almost everyone that I know that rides two strokes in Australia swears by Motorex. They all reckon it runs cleaner and crisper. And everybody users 98 octane as well.
    Ive been using Castrol TTS for years without any problems at all which maybe another brand you could look at. Most guys say TTS is a bit smoky which is true. I had a heap of TTS given to me, and will try Motorex when it runs out, which will be shortly.
    Im sure in Australia your can buy Motorex in 5 litre containers. Maybe its the same here. Would work out cheaper.
    There's no way I would run the Shell mineral based oil in a high performance bike like your Husky.
    If there's a 500 baht difference between the Motul and Motorex, I be going for the Motorex. Trail riding you would be lucky to use 10 litres of fuel in a day. So 125 baht extra per ride. Or 20 rides an extra AUD$100
    I did use Motul in my 2001 Husky and didn't like it at all.

    Just my opinion, others may not agree.

  8. brian_bkk

    brian_bkk Ol'Timer

    Cheers rexy for checking with your mates back home.

    Almost finished my 1 litre of motul T 2. Bike running fine.

    We now have 4 two stroke bikers in pattaya. Will update with what other oils we can get and are suitable for the husky.

  9. brian_bkk

    brian_bkk Ol'Timer

    Just to add.. I use around 14 litres on a 100 - 120 KM ride..
    Getting on average 7km to 1 litre.

    Leif just had the piston and rings done and is back up to 10 km for 1 litre.

    A thirsty bike indeed.. LOL

    But what a machine...
  10. Fishenough

    Fishenough Ol'Timer

    Hello Brian,

    Can I pipe in? Not an expert, but a petroleum chemist, plus given that I've analysed two stroke oils via gas
    chromatography and ICP, inductively coupled plasma mass spectro, should be ok. Plus 2 stroke engine sounds still get my blood boiling though I won't MX ride anymore.

    Where I find choosing different brand 4 stroke oils is a waste of money on most engines, but for high compression, super high RPM, bike engines, as most 4 stroke oils are vastly similar in use. Helpful additives make up a very small percent of the product. Testing a varity in school years ago the difference were negligible to the point of being unmeasurable.

    2 stroke oil on the other hand can be 8% to over 20% additives to a mix of base oils. From the little I've learned for example, I will buy marine 2 stroke oil for marine usage without exception. To quote: Additives include anti-oxidants, viscosity improvers, anti-wear compounds, corrosion inhibitors, anti-foaming agents, detergents, ZDDP, and emulsifiers. Many additives do double or triple duty from this list, Zinc for example (um if it's still used today as an additive....) would work as an anti oxidant, anti wear, corrosion inhibit. That's why 2 stroke oil is was run through an ICP machine, to determine the metal components, such as zinc and sulfur (I know, I know). Plus there are some long chains lubricating additives like polyisobutylene, which will be governed by oil standards met. I know what standards I buy in Canada, ISO E-GC and API-TC - from which I look for both, but don't know what standards exist in Thailand.

    Long and short of it, I do buy pricey quality 2 stroke oils and confidently buy big box store no name branded 4 stroke oil.

    Moto-Rex and hs0zfe like this.
  11. brian_bkk

    brian_bkk Ol'Timer

    Cheers for the info. Much appreciated.
    Attached from the bike manual

    DSC_2594-1024x576.JPG DSC_2593-1024x576.JPG

    Attached Files:

  12. Fishenough

    Fishenough Ol'Timer

    Check out the the JASO website, they list each years approved oils as all standard branches should. I do know that other petroleum products have printed that they meet a given standard, yet the product is not on the list. Some cases can be resulting from these products came out after the list submissions, or, and it does happen, the label was printed stating the standards were met yet they were not. It hit the news that a popular diesel fuel additive did not meet the standard listed on the label, but it still sells with a different label.


    hs0zfe and brian_bkk like this.
  13. hs0zfe

    hs0zfe Ol'Timer

    Well, I've owned strokers and have a deep love for their explosive power since I bought my first, a Yamaha RD 350 YPVS. Back then, I used Castrol TTS. Nowadays, I look for fully synthec + a brand name. Last Sunday, I no longer saw the black SHELL oil and I bought the one you showed, the small bottle @ 68 Baht.

    BTW, I add a bit to the fuel for my 4-stroke bikes. The ashes are beneficial, JMHO. (No offense if you declare me barking mad).

    For 4-stroke oils, I'm partial to Liqui Moly's with MoS2. Saw a test on Youtube vs the excellent Mobil 1. Otherwise, I trust the API specification. Thehigher the letter in the alphabet, the tougher the tests. API SN means you won't go wrong. Look for JASO for motorcycles...

    Ride on!
  14. brian_bkk

    brian_bkk Ol'Timer

    Motul make two different 2T oils.
    One for offroad too. Only found this after the non offroad version.

    Standard 2t was 600 baht or 650 and met the husky manual requirements.

    The other I never used and can only guess more expensive. Leif was running low and I was heading north on my road trip and let him have it. DSC_2601-640x360.JPG
  15. brian_bkk

    brian_bkk Ol'Timer

    Picked up a box of repsol 2T offroad from dirtworx pattaya. If you want to order sure he will ship up country.

    Purchase by the litre 550 baht. Take a box of 12 500 baht a litre.

    I figure. Even if MotoRex oil is from gods very own reserve and gives me 10% additional wear and tear. At a saving of 8400 baht for 12 litres.. A piston and ring set only costs 7000 baht. This has to be a fair compromise on wear and tear, performance as well as value for money.

    Plesse feel free to keep adding to this post with any additional facts or other brands DSC_2867-600x1067.JPG DSC_2866-600x1067.JPG

    Will update how this goes. Getting the new piston and rings done next week.

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