Thai brand oils

Discussion in 'Technical' started by Hua Hin, Mar 9, 2013.

  1. Was in Real Motorsports yesterday looking for Shell Ultra synthetic oil. They didn't have it but offered a Thai made oil. Sun'soil 4T Syn Tech 10W-40. The boys were quick to point out that it's semi-synthetic although the bottle would lead you to believe it's a full synthetic. They said it's what they are using on all the bikes they sell/service. Anyone currently using this oil?

    I bought some and will try it on my Versys.
  2. First impression, the oil seems to be ok. Similar in appearance and feel to other synthetic oils I've used. Will do a trip to Chiang Mai and see how it holds up.
  3. My gut tells me to avoid no-name oils, but on the other hand, if Real Motorsports is using it in the bikes they sell they'll be on the hook for any warranty claims that might arise from using substandard oil, so hopefully it is a quality product. Best of luck! Let us know how it goes!
  4. Yes I feel the same about no-name oils and most things that are Thai knock-offs. However there are a few decent Thai made items so I'm not sure what to think about the oil. Time will tell. I'll depart tomorrow from Hua Hin towards Chiang Mai for a 10 day ride. That should be a good test of the oil.
  5. Even shell advance ultra synthetic is not actually a full class 5 synthetic it is a class 4 minreal base synthetic ,,, MOTIL 3000v full synthetic is available all over thailand and is a very good oil can be had in 10-40 or even better 15-50 for the hot climate ....its what i put in my ducatis .
  6. Kawi's at phuket filling a veloil 10w40 dont know if its any good but looks ok quality of bottle and stuff.. but may be anyone will aware me from using this one?
  7. I use Castrol fully synthetic its the best oil bar none in my opinion and I must have tried them all over the years.
    Never clutch slip and makes the bike run so smooth.
    Why waste money on cheap oil as oil is the blood of your bike put good oil in it and it should go for years trouble free.
    You can buy Castrol no propblem in Thailand I
  8. oil is cheap, engines are not
    I would be loath to use a no-name oil
  9. I used Shell Advance AX7 4T (10W/40) for the last 2 years in my Ninja 250 (close to 14,000 km now, all CBD and urban commuting) ...No problems at all with this oil

    I wanted to use the Shell Advance Ultra 4T but could never locate it in Bangkok around where I live.

    It used to be "easy" to get but the large Shell Servo near me has not been able to get it for a while?

    I got my bike serviced by RIT Motorbike recently (was getting them to do a lot of modification work, so I threw a service in as well)

    They had the $$$ brands like Motul and Agip...but they also had some Gulf Syntrac

    I never used this oil before (but I have heard of Gulf before but it was quite "rare") and it was well priced so I tried it...No problem at all with this oil, no clutch slip or nothing...I like I have a choice of 2 x good quality and well-priced oil now (Shell and Gulf...but I actually prefer the Gulf now)


  10. Can you post a good picture of the bottle front and back please?
    Try to keep the writing in focus if you can;)
  11. As an aside I am struggling how one considers one brand "better" than another or even acceptable without an in-depth analysis of what the base stock is, the critical performance criteria, and what the additives are. If this information is not readily available, I would simply buy a brand that is forthcoming with this critical information.

    Having said that:
    Most motorcycles, unlike cars, have a wet clutch, so besides the what oil is "better" discussion, it also behooves one to consider what oil will not destroy my clutch. Combine the water cooled bike lower viscosity oils with a formulation that includes additional quantities of molybdenum-based friction modifiers and you get the new Energy-Conserving GF-5 / SN designation shown in the API Service label on the back of the container.

    Dino or synthetic, I would be very reticent in using any brand of car oil with the latest GF-5/SN spec in a bike with a wet clutch.
    Our saving grace is that diesel oil or automobile-specific heavier weights like Mobil 1 - 15W/50 do not carry this GF-5/SN designation because of its higher viscosity. A higher viscosity oil's resistance to flow, is the reason why automobile-specific oils that are not energy conserving have been used successfully in wet-clutch motorcycles without slippage problems.

    Key to the clutch issue is the question of friction modifiers. The real issue is to avoid getting the friction so low, with very thin oils containing extra amounts of friction modifiers, (usually high Moly levels) that clutches will slip under normal use.
    Exxon-Mobil claims, that the formulation of motorcycle-specific Mobil 1 has none (??) of the friction modifiers that could lead to clutch slippage in some wet-clutch motorcycles. A moot point as we cannot get M1 bike oil in Thailand, however most if not all "bike oil" manufacturers make similar statements.
    This is supposed to be the current compelling reason to avoid some automobile-specific formulations that now contain friction modifiers to meet fuel economy mandates, when previously they did not. Wet-clutch slippage can be a problem, and seen more often when you use the lower viscosity oils that are designated "Energy-Conserving" on the bottle.

    In reality, all oils have friction modifiers - that's how oil does its slippery, oily, work.
    ZDDP (Zinc Dialkyldithiophosphate), has been the chief anti-wear, extreme pressure, and anti-oxidant additive for decades. It is so effective and low cost that it is virtually irreplaceable, which is why it survives all efforts to remove phosphorus (Ph) from oils to protect the catalytic converter.
    With modern oils putting caps on the maximum Ph allowed, other additives are now being used to supplement this old standard, such as molybdenum anti-wear compounds and ashless anti-oxidants.

    It is your bike and use what you like.
    I believe that the best oil, and best available filter, (I like Purolator Pure 1 filters) is cheap insurance. In Thailand I buy fully synthetic Mobil 1 Delvac, or Mobil 1 Turbo Diesel Pickup oil as it has the highest ZDDP concentration of all the Mobil synthetics, and readily available at Mobil Dealers locally or if on the road at many Esso stations. Just try buying some esoteric "bike" oil on the road
    In Canada I run Mobil 1 - 15W/50 due to an even higher level of ZDDP than the diesel oils and exemption from the new API spec. Unfortunately, like M1 bike oil, I have not seen this in Thailand

    Be aware of the detrimental effect of high ZDDP levels if you have a CAT on your bike or even care if it is degraded by ZDDP

    Synthetic oils typically have a greater viscosity index (VI) or the ability to retain viscosity over varying temperature ranges) over Dino oils. The VI degrades over time, so change your oil often, or top up regularly , or you will tend toward wet-clutch slippage no matter what type of oil you use.
  12. Been trying to post a picture of the bottle here but I don't get it. As I get older I'm working hard to become computer illiterate.

    You can see the specs on their web site.
    Sun'soil 4T Syn Tech 10W-40

    I now have 3,500km on the bike with this oil. Seems to be ok to me. I do however tend to change my oil and filter more often than most as I park the bike for extended periods and never leave it sitting with dirty oil. I have 2 more rides planed this week then will drop the oil and see how it looks compared to other oils I've used.
  13. Why would you even think of putting any thing in your bike but a named quality oil that is known all over the world.
    I have done up to 200 thou ks on some bikes never had an engine failure as I only use quality oil.
    You would be the first to complain if something happens to your bike and you can blame your self for saving a few baht on oil unbelievable.
    I even take my castrol power 1 fully synthetic to Kawasaki for an oil change as they do not sell it.
    Do your self a favour look down a couple of quotes to Hog heads quote oil is cheap engines are not.
  14. Sunsoil's website is sadly lacking in Specs but I do see the dreaded CF designation for the bike oil you are using
    They also toss around the words 'friction modifier" which makes me a bit nervous
  15. David,

    I'm a mechanic and well aware of the value of oil. I bought this bike with the intention of being the first and final owner. I don't really care if I blow the engine as I'm capable of rebuilding it myself. I change the oil every 3-4K so I don't see the "value" in running expensive oils just because of the brand name.

    I've used Diesel oil in bikes in the past and had bad luck with them so I'm only using bike specific oil now.

    Yes I do understand Hoghead's concerns and understand the specs.

    Please don't take this as a flame but I do get offended when I hear the negativity about Thai products. I don't personally know the chemist at sunsoil but I'm fairly sure if they can refine a semi or fully synthetic oil they probably have a bit of education.

    So my point is it's not all bad hear in LOS. Time will tell if this oil is crap or not. I'll be the test case.
  16. I don't give Rats if you blow your bike up we are here to give advice to you, you can take it or leave it.
    If your a mechanic you must be a pretty bad one I would not let you close to any machine, as a mechanic one of the first things we learnt was to put in quality products if you want to look after a machine with quality parts and lubricants.
    I never use diesel oil in any bike and would not advise any one to but its your bike you can put water in your oil may be that will save you a few hundred Baht.
    I rode motorbikes professionally also for 20 years and mechanics where a dime a dozen a good one is gold and unfortunately I have yet to find a good mechanic in Thailand Im sure there is one some where but these forums are full of horror stories from people who have taken there bikes to professional mechanics in Thailand though im sure there are also some very good stories as well.
    I am still working with some of speedways top riders in Australia and yes we only use a world renowned quality product we race here with silkolene and only use quality products and lubricants for the highest amount of stress that can be put on an engine.

    I will say again I have never in my riding ever had an engine seizure using quality oil I guess after 50 years im just lucky then.
    Happy Biking.
  17. Khun David,

    Your teeth are sharp my friend. I'll have to default to your 50 years of knowledge because, well, I'm only 43 so I'm not there yet.

    My original post asked if anyone had used Thai brand oils. Good, bad or otherwise.

    I changed oil on the bike yesterday and can say that the oil was similar to other synthetic oils I've used after 6000K. I changed the oil at 4000K so it may or may not be good. For sure better than a dino oil. Only time will tell if it's good or not.

    As an aside, can I ask why everyone thinks it's about saving 100 Baht? I spend a lot of money on my toys and I'm not bothered about the cost. (Of course that's based on if someone wants to keep paying me lots of money to be their hack mechanic.)
  18. Diesel oil for pickups works very well in Harley Davidsons in Thai conditions ,,, actually HD themselves reccomend it if you cant source their own brand oil which is actually made by belray in USA

    the technical reason is that pennsoil pickup diesel oil is able to withstand 280c engine temps found in most pickup thrucks and aircooled HDs can easily get over 220c in traffic .

    but dont use it on any other bike
  19. Mobile 1 Delvac Full Synthetic...For the BIG RIGS...Been running it in the KTM 950s Adventure here in Thailand for the past 2 years.

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