Is gasohol risk quantifiable? attempt to come to a conclusio

[PICO-PICO]

Having glanced over this subject again, after some time.

I wanted to come to a conclusion on the Gasohol vs Non-gasohol discussion.

there seem to be no statistical and scientific prove that using gasohol causes any quantifiable damages to a motor.

Consequently the conclusion is= buy a Rolex or a Casio as you wish, both will show you correct time
(albeit within normal production variations, not different from any other product )

Petrol companies are only too glad to follow the popular call of its costumers for more "luxurious Rolex type petrol"
It is their job to maximise profits to the sharholders.

(The question, is profit also the overriding responsibility is a very separate issue and would be fruitless here)

Pico

 

[johngooding]

PICO-PICO wrote:

there seem to be no statistical and scientific prove that using gasohol causes any quantifiable damages to a motor.

Consequently the conclusion is= buy a Rolex or a Casio as you wish, both will show you correct time
(albeit within normal production variations, not different from any other product )

My experience echo's your conclusions, but there will still be some who have an unpleasant nagging feeling that the gasohol will eat away at their motors, and so will not use it. As you say, up to the buyer.

However cannot agree that a Casio is of similar time keeping ability to a Rolex, in fact the Casio is much more accurate and capable of accurate timekeeping over a much longer period without maintanence, apart from battery changes every few years. Leave the Rolex in the drawer for a few days and it will stop telling the time. Why buy a Rolex then???? Well certainly not to tell you the time.

 

[monsterman]

Yesterday I had to help strip the carbs on a 2004 Triumph Bonneville as Gasohol had destroyed the seals and Diaprahms ....that bike is supposed to be gasohol compliant but the damage is exactly the same as my wifes Rebel carbs .

Also Ducati North America is still swopping plastic tanks for 2006 up Ducatis for steel tanks to try and avoid a Class action legal suit and a Toyota type investigation which would be really bad for the company..

Nissan Chonburi have mentioned to me that gasohol does seem to cause rot in fuel system components more than regular gas ,they have to keep stock of components that in past years were rarely fixed such as fuel lines,gaskets injectors ,pumps the chiif engineer said that before gasohol was the norm ,they only needed such parts for petrol cars maybe once a month now its a few times a week. He said that Toyota and Honda guys had noticed the same long term corrosive effects in need for extended parts inventories at the Thai Motor show trade meetings.

I use gasohol but I take precaution to minimise long term risk by filling tank with pure fuel every month to clean the system

 

[DavidFL]

AS one of the leading dinosaurs on this website & with a bike fast approachng 300,000 kms on the clock I now have to admit that I have finally relented & been running 95 gasohol in my AT for the last few months to save costs. And what do I notice - not much, but probably better fuel consumption & performance if anything.

 

[furyrider]

David
Maybe I just read to much on the Web from the forums that I frequent. I have used gasohol 95 and 91 in the short times I am able to be home to ride and have no trouble so far.
I read the other day that the alcohol will separate from gas and settle to the bottom if stored for a long time. Now if this is true it is a scary for me having to leave my bike sitting for 8 months. I have my wife starting the bike every few weeks along with the tractors that sit until I am home. Also if it is true their must be an additive like Sta-bil to add in. Not sure it all could be a ploy to sale additives how knows.
I have been trying to find out what kind of additives there are in Thailand to have my wife add a little in the tank with no success.

 

[David Learmonth]

Suggest if you are going to leave it parked up for any length of time that you leave it with 91 petrol in the tank. My 2007 Bonnie T100 runs very well on either 91 or 95 gasahol but when I'm leaving it for more than a week without use - the last tank is 91 petrol. I've found that gasahol does not store well.

 

[furyrider]

Thats good advise David Problem is I filled the tank not knowing the following week I would be leaving.

 

[johnnysneds]

monsterman;249774 wrote: One thing i noticed in my recent trip to the highlands of northern thailand is that when my Ducati was filled with gasohol it ran noticably weaker at altitude in the mountains than on Shell V power the engine laboured even on downhill runs using gasohol.

strange eh.

+1

Just been riding around the Nan area for the past few days. My bike is recommended to run on 95 octane rated fuel, either Benzine or Gasohol. When filled with Gasohol 95 there is noticeable laboring from the engine, however fill her up with Shell V Power (Benzine 95) and it disappears.
This should not be the case, very strange indeed!

 

[KenYam]

Yeah Furyrider I agree completely with David L, I do the same, its the easiest and safest method. So if you don't want hassels later drain the Fury tank and refill will ordinary 91.

I see awhile back Red Baron selling 2 Fury's I assume you got yours from R. Baron ?
How have you found the bike for riding, handling, servicing and parts in Thailand ?
What about storage on long trips ( saddlebags ) ?

Cheers Ken F

 

[furyrider]

Yes I bought it from Red Baron.

I have found it to be good handling and well balanced. She can still do a slow U turn on most of the 2 lane roads however she is a peg dragger but still will lean a long ways after that before i start rubbing the pipes. But I didn't buy it to race I just wanted to cruise in style. In town traffic trying to split lanes can be a little challenging and it is a bit long. I usually am not in a hurry so that don't matter me ether. I think as far as cruiser/choppers go Honda nailed this one. Now I have not been able to ride much ether I am just over 1000 KM. But that will change at the end of this year. It has also been over 20 years since I had been ridding on a big bike. And although it all came back to me when I turned the key and hit the starter there was still some reacquainting time.

I have been working in Iraq and have been ordering all the mod parts from the states and having them sent by APO to me here and hand carrying the parts into Thailand. I don't think there are any parts specific to the Fury in Thailand. Although this is the same 1300 engine they have on the VTX Just fuel injected now. I have been able to find everything for the Fury on line in Japan and the States. That will mean shipping and import fees.

As for the servicing I haven't done it yet. The first service I will do as soon as I get back home. The oil filter is easy to get to. The final is just a gear oil change. The drive line has splines that need to be greased every year. Really with the drive shaft and finale there is not a lot to do for many KM. I was going to go through it just to check every thing at the first service, check torque and valve gap.Remember this is assembled in Thailand so everything should be checked. I belong to a Forum for the Fury and have done a lot of talking to the other fury owners about what problems the have had now that the bike has been out almost 2 years and some have a lot of miles so far. out of the 2800 members 2 fuel pumps have gone out 1 has had heat damage on the front cylinder. He had a rock hit his radiator and pocked a hole in it. Their have been a slew of batteries that had to be replaced the first year. 4 reported shifting issues and thats about it. I was going to order a spare fuel pump and injectors just to have on hand.

I have bought a set of saddle bags that I will mount when I get home. I have a Ginz sissy bar and and luggage rack that hooks to the sissy bar and mount that I will be able to secure a large pack to. It is also removable so it will come off when I don't need it. I also have a custom C&C seat that will be a lot better for the longer rides. Once I am home and get all of this done I will be posting more Photos.

By the way I am still looking for a big bike jack to buy. If anyone knows were one can be had PM me.

 

[Cruising]

Have been in numerous debates about benzine and gasahol and finally came to the conclusion that Shell don`t sell bezine in Thailand.

http://www.shell.co.th/home/content/tha-en/products_services/

 

[johnnysneds]

Cruising;268673 wrote: Have been in numerous debates about benzine and gasahol and finally came to the conclusion that Shell don`t sell bezine in Thailand.

http://www.shell.co.th/home/content/tha-en/products_services/

Yes they do. The Shell station around from where I live sells it. The pump however does state V-Power Gasohol 95. I got the missus to ask the manager and he assures me the pump is knocking out Benzine 95. It may be that they are just finishing off the Benzine and then introducing the Gasohol :cry:

Would be good to know if there is a quick test to check if it is Benzine. Is there a difference in colour?

 

[Cruising]

johnnysneds;268675 wrote: Yes they do. The Shell station around from where I live sells it. The pump however does state V-Power Gasohol 95. I got the missus to ask the manager and he assures me the pump is knocking out Benzine 95. It may be that they are just finishing off the Benzine and then introducing the Gasohol :cry:

Would be good to know if there is a quick test to check if it is Benzine. Is there a difference in colour?

Thais will usually tell you what you want to hear.

Benzine is the yellowy colour and gasahol the red.

From this site here http://www.eppo.go.th/retail_prices.html Caltex,PT,Susco and Petronas are the only companies in Thailand who sell Benzine 95.

So there is enough doubt in my mind that i avoid Shell stations.

I use 91 Benzine,proper Benzine 95 should be around 47-49 baht/litre ATM.

 

[johnnysneds]

Just drained some fuel from my tank. Last station I filled up was a Shell Station (V-Power Gasohol 95). As you can see from the photo below it must be Benzine.. "Benzine is the yellowy colour and gasahol the red"

 

[Cruising]

It certainly looks Benzine Johnny.
How much per litre did you pay for it? it should around 47-49 baht?
I usually check out the price per litre before i fill up with the 91 Benzine just to convince myself that i am getting what i want.

It`s strange that Shell don`t mention 95 Benzine on either of those links i posted.

 

[johnnysneds]

Im not certain but I don't think the price per liter was that high. I find this strange also, but as you can see it looks like Benzine!!!

 

[Cruising]

Because Shell sell 2 kinds of 95 maybe they colour them differently?

I`d be looking for a Caltex,PT,Susco or Petronas station selling 95 for between 47-49 baht/litre (ATM) just to be sure that i am getting what i want.

Thats only my opinion,i am no expert.

 

[ray23]

Pico with the cost of fuel today it leaves a lot of room for carb overhauls ect. I went to Gasohoil 95 on the 93 Kawasaki VN 800. The previous owner used it before I had it. As a part of the rebuild I did I had the carb gone through it was not in bad shape and had 70K Klms on it.

So in my dream world you will go a long ways before it harms the carb. Performance is just fine.

 

[monsterman]

Ducati have changed over 25,000 tanks in USA due to 10% gasohol warping the plastic tanks its cost them $millions and Acerbis who make the tanks for ducati still cant find a plastic formula that works !!!!!!!ducati have a major problem but refuse to manufacture steel tanks so there are many customers who are very angry ,,,,,EU gasohol is a different formula at present so the problem is mostly confined to ducati USA .The class action against Ducati in the USA courts was successful but the judge unfortunately did not speciy what material should be used in the replacemnt tanks .KTM are also using Acerbis as fuel tank manufacturer and some KTMs in USA also affected .

Honnda dealers in UK have told me that when bikes are built in Japan they are filled with 1/20th litre of non gasohol for testing and shipping as the bike may be in shipping containers for up to 3 months and any residues may damage the system...go figure so the word is for long term storage fill with regular benzine if possible or drain the system.

 

[PICO-PICO]

so if I read correctly, Ducati doesn't use steel tanks...... for production cost reasons? Or for weight reasons?

If for production cost reasons than the equation would be =

Cost savings to Ducati p.a.
compared to
higher consumption cost p.a. to xxnumber Ducati bikers.

Who is the big loser?

Too naive?

 

[monsterman]

Ducati officially say that its weight saving and that would follow Ducati Ethos in recent years that has seen an average of 10% weight reduction on their bikes added to improved engine power result massive performance increases .However the cost of the plastic tank problem may be impacting on ducati finances and customer base in a very negative fashion and they are just digging a big hole fighting in USA courts ,,,,would be better to return to steel for peace of mind even at a couple of kilo weight penalty .