Denied Entry At Poi Pet From Thailand!

Discussion in 'Cambodia - General Discussion Forum' started by faynce, Dec 24, 2016.

  1. Col Douglas

    Col Douglas New Member

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    #26 Col Douglas, May 23, 2018
    Last edited: May 23, 2018
    The part what differs from Laos is that Cambodian customs don't issue a temporary import paper's?

    Not sure why you mentioned Laos, but Cambodia doesn't have any temporary import papers or system in place. Just ride out of Thailand (or Laos) and the same upon your return. The only time I was asked for any customs paper's for my Thai bike was crossing from Cambodia to Laos, the Cambodian asked for import paper's, but we both knew that the only paper he wanted was USD.

    Insurance was a legal requirement in Laos and I bought it as soon as I crossed the border. Whereas, I'm unaware of any legal requirement in Cambodia for insurance. If you can get insurance it would be good to have. From my experience if you have an accident its going to be down to your negotiating skills, whether it was your fault or not. Involvement of the local police is probably going to make things worse (for you). Also, don't expect the other driver/rider to have insurance, driving licence or money for that matter.
    Hope this helps
     
  2. Azoulay

    Azoulay Ol'Timer

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    Hi Friends, Hi Col,

    I just posted few days ago a question on border crossing with my car from Thailand to Cambodia, at date no answer, GT-Rider is not anymore what it was years ago but OK...
    Maybe you know if we need a Carnet de Passage for the bike/car or a kind of International passeport for the car/bike.

    Thanks in advance for your answer.

    Keep the Power On !
     
  3. Dodraugen

    Dodraugen Ol'Timer

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    Cambodia is not a Carnet country and has never been so either. But in some cases the latest years international travellers have used a Carnet, or got it stamped at least when entering Cambodia with vehicles from Europe, Australia, America etc. So at some bordercrossings into Cambodia there are definetively a certain knowledge of the use of a Carnet and maybe some expectations that international travellers should have it. But this doesnt go for thai vehicles at all. So if your vehicle is thai plated you should not be worried about this.

    Another thing I have read lately on international traveller forums is that now you need a certain permit from central authorities in Phnom Penh to be able to enter Cambodia. Its mentioned that it can be prearranged, but I have also heard about travellers that had to leave their vehicle at the border and take a bus from the border to Phnom Penh and arrange the the permits themself there and then take a bus back again. As I understand this permit thing might also be a mandatory thing for thai vehicles, although Im far from sure about it.
    I also know that the smaller borders into Cambodia such as O’Smach in Surin province and Hat Lek in Trat province seldom has such demands. One of those borders are probably youre best option to avoid any document problems.
     
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  4. Azoulay

    Azoulay Ol'Timer

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    Hi Friends, Hi Dodrogen,

    Thanks for your answer, I'll continue to investigate on that but for sure I will try to cross border around Hat Lek in Trat.

    I plane this trip for June and will let you and GT-Rider Friends let you know about it.

    Keep the Power On !
     
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  5. matt939

    matt939 New Member

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    I also would be interested in those questions. No customs declaration for temporary imported vehicles needed? And how about insurance?
     
  6. Jimenator

    Jimenator Ol'Timer

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    Nothing has really changed for entering Cambodia by car or bike from Thailand. Thai cars (and bikes) can still enter at Koh Kong and O'Smach as usual. There are occasional reports of O'Smach holding onto registration documents to ensure you exit the same way but usually this is not the case. If you enter very early or late in the day you can probably avoid customs altogether as there'll be no one in the hut. Even during the day, especially around lunch time the hut may be unmanned. Or you could just wing it and not stop at the hut at all (it's unlikely anyone would notice, but do this at your own risk).

    Permits are required for other borders for ALL foreign registrations. Exceptions apply to Thai vehicles travelling locally within the border town only (reciprocated by Thai customs for Cambo vehicles entering at these borders). Indeed at Koh Kong they are strict about not letting you pass if you don't agree to have your registration held with customs. Last year I saw a Malaysian car that was refused entry because the driver either didn't bring along his/her registration, didn't let customs keep it or told them he was planning on driving beyond Koh Kong province. Other Malaysian registrations were held by customs (I saw 5 Malaysian cars heading in the direction of Koh Kong later that evening as I was heading towards Sihanoukville).
     
  7. Jimenator

    Jimenator Ol'Timer

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    No insurance available at the border BUT it's possible to arrange it in a larger city or via a broker/tour agency who will also arrange the official customs paperwork.

    Most people just take the risk and don't bother with it. Not everyone has the luxury of being able to plan trips weeks or months in advance, especially not local Thais who just want to do some business or trading in Cambodia. They generally don't have thousands of Baht to make everything official.

    Ditto for me, I travel to neighboring countries for both business and pleasure and either decide on a whim to go, or only know my exact travel dates a few days beforehand. Having to plan everything a month or so in advance would be a deal breaker for me and many other people.
     
  8. Dodraugen

    Dodraugen Ol'Timer

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    The permit thing for international vehicles in Cambodia is certainly new. It was never heard of amongst overlanders before approx last half of last year. So certainly there is something that has changed there too....
     
  9. Jimenator

    Jimenator Ol'Timer

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    #34 Jimenator, Jun 19, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2018
    Somehow I doubt that. Only O'Smach and Koh Kong allow foreign vehicles in without a permit and that has been the case for years. It's highly unlikely they would have welcomed third country vehicles which just showed up before mid last year - in fact, I read an interesting blog about a Singaporean car refused entry at Poipet in 2016 and before the Chinese were restricted to enter Thailand, some attempted to enter Cambodia at Poipet and were refused too. Koh Kong holds onto your registration and doesn't allow travel outside the province but now overlanders from third countries may be more restricted than before. O'Smach should still be OK though. In any case, third country registrations (other than Malaysian and Singaporean) are extremely rare in Cambodia. I haven't seen any for a few years now.
     
  10. Dodraugen

    Dodraugen Ol'Timer

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    Can you mention one example of an overland vehicle/traveller that needed a permit to enter Cambodia from Thailand before 2017?

    About overlanders in Cambodia: I read weakly about different kind of overlanders in Cambodia on different kind of forums and facebook groups. For example Sihanoukville is now used as a shipping international vehicles into and from point since Thailand started their mandatory permit/guide rules in 2016.
    Just because you havent spotted one doesnt mean that they dont exist.....
     
  11. bangwan3030

    bangwan3030 Member

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    I've entered Cambodia through poi pet recently without any problem

    just stamp your passport and go to Cambodia Custom. Pass your vehicle grant and the custom will write the information

    and that is
     
  12. Jimenator

    Jimenator Ol'Timer

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    That's very vague. Could you be more specific please?

    Poipet does not allow foreign vehicles to enter without a permit from all the accounts I've read/heard (except some local Thai vehicles remaining within the border area). Occasionally foreign vehicles make it across and then end up doing a runner after escaping Cambodian customs, but that is not recommended.

    Could you outline the procedure you used?

    Thai customs normally warns you that Cambodia may not let you enter. What did they tell you.

    What is the country of registration of your vehicle?

    When did you make the entry?

    What documents did you have to fill out?

    Did you possess a permit?

    Did you cross by motorcycle or car?
     
  13. Jimenator

    Jimenator Ol'Timer

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    Cambodia has not changed it's rules. Foreign registrations can't enter at Poipet both before 2016 and now. Occasional exceptions exist, but nearly everyone that drives to Cambodia, whether by Thai or foreign car/motorcycle enters at O'Smach with smaller numbers (mainly Thais and occasionally Malaysians) at Koh Kong. Exceptions are permit holders - plenty of stories online about overlanders entering Cambodia with proper permits. For simple trips in/out of Cambodia entering at O'Smach and exiting at any border for Thailand or Laos, a permit is not necessary but then you are on your own, you don't get insurance and the police in Phnom Penh will stop and fine you if you go there. Sihanoukville can also be a problem, elsewhere - no issues.
     
  14. Dodraugen

    Dodraugen Ol'Timer

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    But you still cant mention one example of an overlander that needed a permit before 2017.... oh well...

    I dont know if Cambodia have changed their rules on this issue but they certainly have changed their enforcing of rules on foreign vehicles entering the country. Permits to enter Cambodia has never been mentioned on any overlander forum until last year where it suddenly became a hot topic. And do you know why? Because it has never before been an issue...go figure
     
  15. Jimenator

    Jimenator Ol'Timer

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    #40 Jimenator, Jul 31, 2018
    Last edited: Jul 31, 2018
    Not true. Its been the case for years that only O'Smach and Koh Kong allow easy entry from the Thai side. You are trying to say you used to be able to enter easily anywhere without making pre-arrangements - this is not true at all (show me proof otherwise?) From a Singaporean car that was denied entry at Poipet in early 2016 (and who didnt know about the ease of entering at O'Smach) to Chinese and other third country registrations, along with all the Thai registrations denied going back 10 years (except those staying with in the immediate border region) Poipet and most other crossings not mentioned have for years required a tour/permit from Phnom Penh for entry.

    The only possible more recent changes i have read about for non-Thai vehicles is at Koh Kong. A permit may be required there now as per a report from a UK registration that entered there a year or two ago - if you agree to stay within Koh Kong province and pay the 100 Baht a day entry fee you may still be allowed in plus your registration will be held by customs. What usually happens is that an overlander (third country registration) comes in at Koh Kong is told they can enter if they follow the rules mentioned above but because they come with an attitude and a sense of entitlement they are told to get a permit because it is assumed they will break the rules and drive around the country. Then again you arent going to drive all the way from England to Cambodia only to restrict yourself to one province.

    O'Smach should still be ok without issues. However, with the Thai permit rules now i wouldnt expect many foreign vehicles wanting to cross in to Cambodia as there are so few driving around Thailand now. Now its pretty much just Thai, Lao, Malaysian and Singaporean vehicles entering Cambodia from the Thai border.
     
  16. Dodraugen

    Dodraugen Ol'Timer

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    What is not true? That you cant prove that a permit was required to enter Cambodia for a foreign vehicle before 2017? Thats is certainly true that you so far havent been able to prove that.

    The Poipet border might have been asking for permits for some time before 2017 but Im talking about in general. There were not ever mentioned anything about permits to enter Cambodia in overland circles before 2017. But when this came up it was mentioned many times in a short time and an overlander couple from France actually settled in Cambo and started to provide these permits for a relatively cheap amount. And that was last year.

    Im not talking about vehicles from Thailand, Malaysia, S’pore, China etc - it might be different laws or enforcing of laws for those.

    And you are also wrong about that there are not many foreign vehicles wanting to enter Cambodia.
    Nowadays more and more overlanders are entering Thailand without permits and guides. Last week a foreign plated campervan (dutch) - who is actually totally prohibited into Thailand entered the kingdom at Mae Sot without any permits or guides. And Mae Sot has been the only border enforcing this new permits/guides rules 100 % so far. There are in fact almost daily reports about foreign vehicles entering Thailand without permits and guides. And probably waaay more entering that not are reported.
    And I presume many of those would like to enter Cambo too...
     
  17. Jimenator

    Jimenator Ol'Timer

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    #42 Jimenator, Aug 1, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 1, 2018
    First of all you might want to actually read other peoples responses before you comment. I have mentioned at least 2 times that a Singaporean car was denied entry at Poipet in 2016. Do I need to post the blog before you believe it? I don't know what you get out of this trying to prove you are right (when you are not). On this and other forums bikes/cars have reported on being denied at various entry points into Cambodia from Thailand stretching back years but O'Smach was always Ok. Nothing is set in stone but the reason there are so few foreign vehicles in Cambodia is due to its inconsistent rules and lack of insurance available at the border.

    Farang are the only people who will expend considerable effort trying to prove a point about something unimportant and difficult to prove (like in this case past Cambodian customs policies) just so they can say: "hey, I'm right". So far we have you repeating the same thing over and over again, obviously choosing not to read what I wrote or misinterpreting it then you start talking about the Thai rules (which is off topic and not the subject of this thread, but while we're on the subject let me make some points about the known inconsistency of rules in Thailand and the region in general):

    Foreign campervans can still occasionally make it into Thailand they aren't necessarily denied outright. Exceptions exist and no Mae Sot is not the only border that is strict. All borders are supposed to follow the same rules but according to my enquiries Aranyaprathet, Tha Li and Chiang Khong all mentioned foreign cars/bikes need permits. Only Chong Chom was willing to let anyone in (except Chinese).

    However, I'm only going to ask a particular border if I'm already there. I haven't been to every border (nor would I go to one if I don't have a good reason to be there, like for example, passing through on my way to a neighboring country). I don't know what each and every border's policies are. I can't comment on why there is no consistency or why Thai customs does not follow its own rules at least at some borders. I do know that these rules have reduced the number of foreign (3rd country) cars and bikes entering Thailand. There aren't as many as used to come before 2016.

    Lao, Malaysian and Singaporean vehicles are exempted from the rules and are NOT treated the same as your Dutch campervan example who is supposed to have a guide and permit even if they occasionally (lik in this case) make it in without one. The Chinese were what prompted this and it seems they are the only ones the law is consistently applied towards even if its supposed to apply to all countries with which Thailand does not share an agreement with.

    Could it be that Thailand has quietly started allowing 3rd country vehicles in without a permit as long as they aren't Chinese registered? Perhaps. Or it might depend on the border or official on duty. I don't know. The official rules call for all third country vehicles to be treated the same but the word in various places seems to be only Chinese registrations are affected. After all, most of the problems came from them and their numbers were becoming unsustainable at the time plus Thai vehicles needed a permit to enter China. Now its tit for tat. There were never any major problems coming from other country registrations/overlanders from western countries. No one country was particularly common, you had vehicles from all sorts of countries traveling the world but until 2016 Chinese vehicles easily outnumbered all other 3rd country registrations something like 20 to 1 or more. So in that sense, is it fair for the Thai authorities to have one rule for Chinese but another for other countries? I used to think no, but now I think, in a sense, yes because China demands reciprocity on many issues so it's totally reasonable that Thailand would demand the same. On the other hand, no one cares what the UK requirements are for a Thai vehicle to enter temporarily and whether it's easier than the reverse - because only a tiny number of UK vehicles ever come to Thailand or vice versa.

    You can still enter Cambodia at O'Smach as before. Even if its the only border that allows entry - one border is good enough. There is no need to argue and get into a bickering fest about the past or other finer points - O'Smach is fine for entry and that's really all you need to know. If that changes for foreign vehicles, let us know. However as of a couple months ago it was definitely still ok.
     
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  18. Dodraugen

    Dodraugen Ol'Timer

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    In stead if caviling about others not reading your postings - which I of course have done up until now but I will certainly stop reading them from now on. So much complete nonsense in one post only its a rare find. And absolutely not worth spending time reading.

    You can say this and that but you can shove a tiny little sign of what you state is true. A singaporian vehicle denied you say. Yes you say, and where is the proof of that? Where is the proof of the rule you keep on refering to that foreign vehicles needed a permit to enter Cambo before 2017? Can you show me the rules in stead of caviling out pure nonsense?

    When it comes to what goes on in overlanding circles you have obviously no clue and thus theres no point at all discussing it with you.

    What rules there are for entering Cambodia with a foreign plated vehicle (not from a neighbor country) I do not know (as I have mentioned before) but I do know there were a change around late 2016-early 2017. Change in rules or change in enforcing rules - who knows. But certainly a change.
    Permits to enter Cambo where never mentioned on Overland forums before that, but since then it has been a subject discussed and mentioned very many times. To an extend a french overland couple actually settled in Cambo and started providing such permits. So a certain change has certainly taken place.
    You can deny and cavil as much as you like - this is a fact.
     
  19. Jimenator

    Jimenator Ol'Timer

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    I don't even know why I'm bothering replying to you, but you're proving my point exactly - you keep rambling on and on going in circles trying to make a point about nothing. You keep referring to before 2017 as some kind of pivotal year when things changed yet offer no proof of that - and besides, who cares about the past? People want up-to-date information about the rules NOW, and which borders are OK for entry now, not what they were back in 2016, 2000 or 1956. That's irrelevant and useless information.

    You are vague, offering no details when I have stated multiple times that O'Smach has been OK for entering Cambodia for years, but other borders like Chong Sa-ngam, Ban Laem/Daung, Poipet and Ban Pakkard/Prom DO NOT allow foreign vehicles in (occasionally, travelers have managed to sneak in or get lucky, but this does not mean Cambodia didn't have requirements to make pre-arrangements for entry, just that they have been inconsistently applied). Back in 2014 I asked at Ban Laem the answer was no vehicles to Cambodia - except for Thai vehicles going to the casino.

    If you're such an expert on the "overlanding" scene, why don't you post some of the discussions going on, on here? Or is it that you have no proof and you just want to win an argument? What's wrong with you? I met your type on a certain overlanding forum over a year ago, full or entitled c**nts who think they have a right to enter every country without paying a dime, complaining about this and that, getting angry when you defend the rules put in place, geez...get a life.

    Tons of foreign vehicles have been denied entry into Cambodia in the past few years IF they entered at places other than Koh Kong or O'Smach. You've got Google, you can do a search and find out the details yourself. Some are mentioned here on this forum, some on Rideasia.net, and there are many others.

    This forum is supposed to offer tips to riders/drivers traveling in the region but this thread has been overshadowed by your constant bickering. Let me remind you where we are - South-East Asia. When a rule is made, it is interpreted differently depending on the official in charge. You can have a rule or a law in place, which is never enforced. That's how it is here - Cambodia has never been an open country for driving foreign vehicles across the border. Yes it has been doable, at some borders at least, for years but that's due to an unofficial agreement between the local Cambodian and Thai [Lao/Vietnamese] checkpoints. What's next, are you going to get into a circular argument and tell me Cambodia has no road rules at all because nobody enforces them? Just because they aren't enforced, doesn't mean they don't exist.

    Just drop the bickering already and let's get back to helping people as this forum was intended to do. If you want to get into a bickering fest, may I suggest dropping over to Khmer440 or Thaivisa.
     
  20. Rudy Regenass

    Rudy Regenass New Member

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    Mmmmm... seems you guys just need gloves. Besides the point though. But I do need some advice and would appreciate same from anyone who has experience which I do not.
    I'm planning a trip through Cambodia, from the Trat side of Thailand. And then thinking of a coastal ride from Sihanoukville into Vietnam. ( I think there is a border at Tx Ha Tien )Then all along the coast via Nha Trang, Da Nang and into Laos, through Laos and enter back into Thailand at Mukdahan. Back to Pattaya via Ubon and Khao Yai.
    So... anyone have experience of the same? Do I need to re-enter Thailand at the same place I left it? Would there be problems with leaving Cambodia from a different place to where I entered it? Any special paperwork I may need for a BMW 310GS?
    Any advice is much appreciated.
     
  21. Jimenator

    Jimenator Ol'Timer

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    OK a few issues here. Firstly, no problems at all re-entering Thailand at a different crossing to the one you exit at. For Thai vehicles, the Thai authorities don't care or even keep track.

    Yes you can enter Cambodia from Trat (Hat Lek) to Koh Kong. However, you may be hit up for a 100 Baht per day fee and your documents held. You may be told not to leave Koh Kong province and return the same way. In practice, there is no problem heading out of Koh Kong (just don't say anything about that to customs) provided you return the same way. I would suggest entering at O'Smach to avoid this issue, even if your intention is to ride the Cambodian coast around Sihanoukville towards Vietnam.

    Secondly, while you won't be prevented from leaving Cambodia with your bike from a different crossing to the one entered, your bike may have a problem entering Vietnam. Now the Ha Tien border is one of the few which seems to allow foreign motorcycles in without a permit. I read somewhere about a Singaporean rider who managed to enter Vietnam on his Singaporean bike through that border recently. Crossing back into Laos should be OK but these days it's a bit of a hit and miss entering Laos by motorcycle even from Vietnam, but if you're on a Thai bike returning you should be OK (try Cha Lo, that's reportedly one of the easier crossings). Back to Thailand via Mukdahan is fine.

    However, your main issue will be getting into Vietnam. If you don't mind the possibility of being refused entry and have time on your hands, by all means go ahead and try Ha Tien. But, if you want to be safe you will need to go on a tour with permit and guide.
     
  22. DavidFL

    DavidFL Administrator
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    Jimenator would be kind enough to post some images of yourself & vehicle (bike or car) at some of your many border crossings please. Some evidence of your border crossing experience would be most appreciated thank you.
     
  23. Jimenator

    Jimenator Ol'Timer

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    I would be happy to do that David. Unfortunately, I didn't take any pictures of my last crossing to Vietnam from Laos, which was some years ago. On my crossings into Vietnam from Cambodia I have never taken a vehicle across; so all I can go on at this time are a combination of official rules, what I've been told by customs officials when I asked and reports on here and other fora.

    Rudy, I do hope you are successful with your trip. Unfortunately with borders in this region and especially with Vietnam, all I can go on are reports I have read including the latest successful one from that Singaporean rider.
     
  24. Philippe

    Philippe Ol'Timer

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    In March this year, I crossed with Cambodian registered bike at Alomg Veng - Surin to Thailand without problem.
    I arrived at Aran-Poipet to reenter Cambodia. The Thai custom, refused me to go out of Thailand this way as I did not have the pre clearance/ permits to enter Thailand.
    At Along Veng-Surin, nobody on both side know about this new requirement.
    So, Thai custom Aran send me back to my entry point 300 Km back to Surin-Along Veng border back in Cambodia.
    THE MAIN PROBLEM IS THAT NOBODY KNOW WHERE AND HOW TO APPLY FOR pre clearance/ permits to enter Thailand from Cambodia.
    I guess there is a website. This permit must be required 10 days before crossing, while the bike is still in Cambodia. One border staff told me that maybe it is at Tourist department in Thailand.

    Any info about this will be welcome.
    Thanks
    Philippe
     
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